Low Pocket Pairs

[pistol984]

I'm having a lot of trouble deciding how to play low pocket pairs at medium to large tables. I dunno if I should be raising big pre-flop to get out a lot of the drawing hands or maybe even just pick up the blinds. I was recently advised to try and get in cheap and hopefully hit trips. I just can't seem to win a hand right now with a low pocket pair.

How does everyone else play a low pocket pair?

[christianu]

Well here is how I play them on cash tables and I have to tell you there my most profitable cards and most of the big pots I win are with these cards.

With a pair lower than Jacks I will always limp in with a pocket pair and like oyu've mentioned look to hit my set. If there is a big raise I will without fail cal with my 33 44 etc.. aware that im probably behind to a big hand like AA or KK but I know if I hit my set which will happen around 1 in 8 times then I am going to take down a big pot from them especially at lower levels where these hands cant be layed down.

Your more often than not getting implied odds for these calls and if you play them like this and put them down easily when you dont hit your set then you should be fine. This is the advice Alien used to give me when I was a beginner and I think it was the best Ive had.

In tournaments playing them is a lot different and a whole load of variables come into play like rising blinds etc..

[pistol984]

Cheers, I appreciate the advice. I'll give that a go and see how it works out for me.

[ONEDUNME]

That's fascinating. No wonder I'm not winning with the fucking things. Gonna give that a go starting NOW.

[Beanie]

Originally Posted by christianu

With a pair lower than Jacks I will always limp in with a pocket pair and like oyu've mentioned look to hit my set. If there is a big raise I will without fail cal with my 33 44 etc..

I'm not sure about the calling a 'big' raise bit christian(really depending on what you're calling big)...as you say you're implied odds if up against an AA or KK are probably quite good.

But given that the chance of hitting your set or better is under 12% on the flop, or only about 8 to 1, if you put your opponent on AA, KK, QQ etc, you'll not want to be calling a raise any bigger than about 12% of their stack surely...so of course it really depends on the size of the raise.

[aliensyndm]

Been quite a few posts about pocket pairs before. I love pocket pairs.
With low-medium pocketpairs ie 2s-10s you wanna get in cheap really yeah.
You'll flop a set with a pocket pair around 1 in 8 times. This is an important figure. OK that's not very often granted but when you do you can pick up some monster pots. Now the thing about pocket pairs is they are perfect hands to call decent raises with. Someone raises big, say 4 or 5 x the BB.
This is usually an advertisment of I have AA or KK etc. Now these are the kinda of hands people cannot lay down. If you have a pocket pair, great, call the raise. Now you flop a set about 1 in 8 times, if the set hits it's very likely you could get the guys whole stack so you have to make sure he has a big enough stack. You will want him to have at least 8 times the size of his raise, preferably alot more. Usually it will be alot more. You have great implied odds here. Now if you miss the set just give the hand up. Be careful that if you call with 88 and the flop comes 2,4,7 you don't get dragged in thinking your hand is good. Most of the time very large pre-flop raises are AA KK QQ, of course you have to judge the guy a bit as well. Even if the guy bets with AK there's still a reasonable chance he will outdraw you so just give it up.
Now if you hit.......now you should be in business. Say you call with 77 and the flop comes 2,7,J , perfect. Now someone holding AA or KK is gonna think they are winning that. Only a very good player will be able to lay down hands like AA on flops like that.

So anyway, you have hit your set, how do you get the most money out of it ?
If you are first to act generally speaking I would bet. Most of the time someone with AA or KK is gonna raise you here. You can then elect to re-raise back or just call. If you check-raise the person this kinda shouts out "I HAVE A MONSTER", also it gives them a chance to get away from the pot more cheaply having only put one bet in than if you bet and they raise you as they have then put in your inital bet and a raise hence have more money committed to the pot and are less likely to give it up.
Of course you can't give definite rules for rach scenario you have to judge the person a bit as well.

At times it will seem like you keep calling with pocket pairs and never ever flop a set and you then begin to think they are a waste of time and cost you money. Be patient you will flop sets(or better) eventually. I've bust many a stack by hitting a set having called a big raise with a pocket pair.


Now other scenarios, if you call with your pocket pair and hit the set with a few people in the pot you cannot afford to slow play them too much.
For instance if you call with 88 and flop 2,8,9 with 2 of the same suit.
Yeah your hand is nice but there are alot of draws out their that can take you out, You have to come out betting and make people pay for these draws.
A person with a flush draw like AQ suited will hit 35% of the time and a person drawing a straight like TJ will hit 31.5% of the time. It;s also possible a person may have a flush and a straight draw here which will hit 54% of the time hence is actually favourite to make the hand. Hence you can't hang around checking. Now you do of course have the chance of making a full house or better yourself, this will happen 37% of the time so they can make their draw and still lose, but you don't wanna be giving them free cards to do this. Get them to put their money in when they are behind and don't have odds to draw. If you get the chance, get all the money in on the flop. With a set you have a made hand. If you get someone all-in with a flush or straight draw they are taking even money for a hand they will only make 35% of the time. Not only this there will be times where they make the hand and lose as you make a full house, hence an even worse bet for them !

Now if you do bet and the turn gives someone a possible flush or straight then you have to be careful. If are few people are in the pot it's likely someone was calling for either a flush or a straight. If you can get a free river, great....you can see if you improve to a full house for free.
If it's gonna cost you, you have to see how much it will cost you to draw the river and weigh this up with how much you stand to make should you make the full house. The implied odds on drawing this card can be beecakely big if you are certain someone has hit their flush and they are deep stacked. If you are certain you will get their whole stack if you hit it then you can draw it when other times you might not. With just the river to comes it's about 22% you will improves to a fullhouse or better. If you can draw this card for a small size bet giving you 4-1 on the pot anyway(or better still get it free), great ! Like I say it can be worth calling it even though you aren't getting pot odds for that bet alone but gettng huge implied odds if the person has hit his hand and will not lay it down and you can get a huge stack from him.


It's different if you flop a full house as obviously you dont have to worry about flushes then. That's another very common stack buster - flush v fullhouse. It's then a question of how to get the most money in the pot !


Summary with low/medium pockets-

Get in cheap and look to hit a set
If you hit and there are draws possible bet aggressively and make people pay
Great hand to call big raises that are probably AA or KK against
Don't get too attached to pocket pairs, 99 on a 2,3,8 board looks not bad but even if an AK is bluffing there's a good chance he'll outdraw you. Or have TT himself !

[christianu]

Yes Beanies right in that I falied to mention Stack sizes, theres no point calling a $3 raise in a 25c/50c cash table if theat player only has $9 left as your implied odds are out of the window.

Make sure he has a nice enough amount there to pay you off, or there are a few people in the pot and Beanie yeah Ill call these big raises as in the long run I know ill take down enough huge pots. Im always weary now when I raise with my AA as i know if I get a few little calls and the flop comes a sneaky J 7 5 them 5's and 7's could be huge. There so easily disguised against the majority of players though.

[christianu]

Fantastic advice from Alien and like I said the best I ever took as a beginner.

[Jezza]

Aliens advice is SPOT ON there, I dont think anyone could have put it any better.

If you are first to go and have a set then look at the stacks. If he is deep (has a lot of money) as you are then you must LEAD the flop just like ken says. You get him to commit himself by raising on the flop (as he will surely do with an overpair). If he is commited after raising on the flop then just move in. If he is good/deep enough to still escape from a move in by you then flat call his raise and kill him with a check raise on the turn.

Jez

[mrmuzeman]

yep alien makes a good post, for a similar read visit back to my posts here and here...

Theres a bit more in depth about the specific hands of JJ and QQ in there too

http://www.thedailypunt.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2753

http://www.thedailypunt.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4273