[JammySFC]

Well chaps, i am led to believe from basically everyone that Cash Games are the place to be playing my poker and that Sit and Gos are generally more for fun or donkeys. To be honest i have never played much of cash and only played SnGs but i am getting sick of them in all honesty and cannot seem to figure out my level whatsoever.

Anyone like i have said i really want to stop playing Sit and Gos and start playing cash games instead. What level do you all recommend i start at and what would be a semi-reasonable bankroll for this? Bear in mind that i am only working part-time so a $500 bankroll just isn't possible for me to dedicate obviously.

Any cash game tips, be they general or otherwise would also be appreciated. I am having massive trouble with my game just now and maybe a few basic tips are all i need to straighten myself out for a while again.

Any replies appreciated. Thanks.

[Doc]

If you're having trouble with your game try and identify which areas? Are you being over-aggressive? Or folding too much? Calling with marginal hands? Playing too much OOP?

First tip I'd give for cash games is to buy in for the minimum till you acclimatize. That'll mean you can play a more similar game to S&G strategy.

BTW - wouldn't knock S&G for making money, they have significantly lower variance than cash games, and that can mean getting more leverage from your bankroll - especially if you play 'rolling' tournaments - .e.g. start a new S&G every 10 mins or so, so you are constantly playing 3 or 4 tournies at once. You can churn through 10-15 in a couple of hours.

[Colbro]

The only advice I can give really is if you have only played SNG's and nothing else the biggest adjustment you need to make is Cash games have a different pace to them.
When I moved from SNG's the biggest mistake I made was subconsciously thinking after 30 -40 mins was having to loosen up because that was what I always did. Cash games have no pace. Its level one all the time. As a result it may feel like a grind at first. That is assuming you play 10 handed ring games of course.

[Jezza]

Hi Jammy,

I am a firm believer in cash games Jammy. It is basically where all the real money in poker is. Its also true that you will find the best players in the world playing in the biggest cash games in the world - and they are not the guys you see winning the big televised MTTs. Although there is still a ton of luck involved of course, the luck factor is a lot less in cash games than it is in STTs especially and also MTTs. That isnt to say MTTs and STTs cant be decent long term earners for the good poker player, they sure can, but they become serious card catching contests towards the end and it really does come down to luck at these points.

The thing about cash games is the stacks are a lot deeper than in MTT/STT style games. This means there is a lot more play. Far more flops are taken, and turn and river play is crucial as well (turn and river play are practically no brainers in MTTs whilst flop play is only minimal, it all revolves around preflop play). Theres a lot more room for manouver and hand reading becomes a lot more important in cash games.

Take this for example.

An STT where you have 1000 chips. The blinds are 50/100. You raise to 300 with AA and you get a call by the blinds. The flop is K44 with two clubs and you bet 300 again after being checked to. The blind player CRaises all in. This is an absolute no brainer call for you. Not a chance in hell you are ever laying this down. However look at a similar situation in a cash game. This time you have 1000 dollars infront of you and are playing 5/10. You get AA again and open for 50 dollars. The big blind calls only and you have the same K44 flop. He checks and you bet 100. He then CR all in for 1000 dollars total. This is a FAR more difficult call/decision to make. If you get it wrong then you are severely out of pocket, if you get it right then you profit big style (be it by folding and saving money when behind or calling and winning it when ahead). Although the decisions are tougher, the rewards are greater.

I would definately suggest you try it out Jammy, cash poker is 100% the most fun and skillfull game of hold em! Perhaps 25c/50c where you buy in for 50 dollars would be suitable for you, or 15c/25c for a 25 dollar buy in. This lets you get used to playing with much deeper stacks without risking too much.

Definately get an account with rakeback on it. Cash players generate the most rake by far for the sites and thus you will get beefcake payments back every month for having rb on your account. I would start off playing full ring where you can wait patiently for hands etc and not have too many tough decisions to start off with. Once you feel comfortable there you can try the 6man/shorthanded tables where you can play every hand!

Jez

[Doc]

I wouldn't disagree with most of the points you make. However the later stages of STT (And MTT) require a lot of skill to play well. Many players are pretty poor about managing their equity here - folding hands they should call with, not moving all-in etc. As the blinds increase hands basically change values and a player who can recognise this has a big advantage over the majority - especially at low buy-ins.

I would also argue that the variance is lower - The most you can lose in 40 mins or so is your tourney buy-in, and if you're playing 6Max tables, you'll rarely (if you're half competent) lose enough tables in a row to really hammer your bankroll. I would suggest that your earn rate as a percentage of your bankroll is higher for the same risk - at least till you get to the big buy-in tourneys.

However, cash game play will definitely improve your tourney play, earn you more rake and there are a ton more games available to choose from typically.

[DAN DAN]

Originally Posted by DoctorOfDanger

However, cash game play will definitely improve your tourney play,

What is your reasoning for that? I think it is played completely differently and can worsen your tournament play.

[Doc]

it forces you to think more about hand reading, bet sizing, patience etc
These are all important, especially in the early stages of a tournament when you're likely to be quite deep stacked. Even for the later stages, it can help you understand why the game plays differently